We'll send you the latest guides and training tips geared However, none of these choices are necessarily easy on the pocketbook, with most loads over $1/round. Little holdover gonna be necessary. If I am just putting holes in paper at 1000+ I'd go 6mm Creed, 6mm Dasher, or 6x47 Lapua. In my opinion, 300-600-ish isn't an unethical shot for those who are genuinely skilled enough to make the shot because people are consistently successful all the time at those distances. Although it will always be there and ready if the need arises. So many variables and I think the age old "it depends". My advice to anyone with an AR in .223 sitting in the safe that has been used only for short-range work, is to dust it off, mount up a Riton scope and see what you can do at extended ranges. AR mount that was already mounted on my Rock River rifle. To continue my thought process of looking into a 6.5/6.8, I am also looking into simply getting a longer ranged .223/5.56 upper with a chrome moly 20" barrel in 1x7. Generally, long-range shooting is pure sport and for sport the effectiveness of the round on target is moot. Love the caliber. mag. Buy Unbranded AR / United Steel Armory UAR-F .223 Wylde Durys # 6533: GunBroker is the largest seller of Semi Auto Rifles Rifles Guns & Firearms All: 982827271 . Honestly, the 223 Wylde is a solution to a problem that didn't really exist. Chances are, you will be pleasantly surprised to find a long-range rifle in your collection that you didnt even know you had. The 6.5C shoots bullets that are more aerodynamic (higher BC) and at faster speeds.. The case mouths were chamfered and the cases went into corn cob media for a final polish before loading. I have news for you, it's not ok! The cases were then full-length resized and trimmed to 1.750 with aDillon Rapid Trim 1500 Case Trimmer. If you cant see your target clearly and make very precise adjustments, hitting at long range becomes an exercise in frustration. Change your name to Karen. when it comes to long range hunting I have to stick to my 7mm mag custom made bolt action, an extremely flat trajectory and shots at over 1000 yards are very common. The .224 Valkyrie uses a faster 1:7 twist, thereby giving the ability to properly stabilize that 90-grain MatchKing, and I believe there are 100- and 105-grain models that will be stable with that twist rate. Anyway be safe shoot str8 and God bless. Try as I might I was not able to ring the 1,000-yard plate. Out of Stock. The general rule: It is safe to fire .223 Rem. we started testing in VIET-NAM, they were great, even at LONG range. The .223 Remington, as designed by Stoner with help . From maximum effective range and kinetic energy to optimal ammunition loads and even the legal status of your firearm, there are a lot of factors to consider, and choosing the right barrel can seem like a daunting task. Admittedly, there are a number of variables at work here. I understand why some hate the round, and its largely the .308 Winchester fanboys. My results with the chosen loads were not what I needed for long-range shooting. Your words is like a Bible. guns & But it is also a test of the rifles inherent accuracy and the ammunition being used. While this may not be the first cartridge that comes to mind for long-range shooting, with an appropriate bullet, the compact .223 Remington or 5.56 NATO is more than capable of shooting over 500 yards with accuracy. Rate it below. My go to for long range hunting are the 7mm STW and 6.5-300 weatherby. It's a quick and easy swap. This allows for better seating of both .223 Remington and 5.5645 NATO rounds. .223 Remington is probably best known as the AR-15's round and as the predecessor of 5.56 NATO. gear. i think the 50 bmg would make most every ones list on this topic. Want to send it really far downrange? Happy Hunting! But for the average shooter, the investment in a long-range rifle and optics system can be a major stumbling block. M193, 55-grain load of Hornady Frontier 5.56 ammo, those provided by Hornady with a 20 barrel, The Best Self Defense Ammo Ballistic Testing. It also has less wind drift and less bullet drop than the .223 Remington or the 6.5 Grendel. Tighter freebore size in a 223 Wylde rifle allows you to shoot .223 ammo with relatively strong accuracy from it than a 5.5645 rifle. The scope is one of Ritons many quality offerings and has a ton of features that long range shooters are looking for at an MSRP of $289.99. Need to recheck your math when you were talking about the .416 Barrett clinking at 5497m. That required 16 MOA elevation correction from my zero. You are using an out of date browser. It is the responsibility of any hunter to put down game as quickly and humanely as possible with a single shot. Prices can be high for match-grade ammo, but Wolf offers extremely affordable plinking ammo with their 100-grain FMJ steel-case loads. Even with kinetic energy factored in, after 500 yards, the 6.5 CM pulls away as the leader due to its retained velocity. Add to Wish List Add to Compare. WildRose Well-Known Member Joined Feb 3, 2011 Messages 15,226 Location N. Texas and S. Africa Apr 23, 2016 #4 Capt. It was a blast, shooting paper at long distances on Uncle Sams dime. Select what level shooter you are! Rifleshooter.com performed an interesting test, cutting the barrel of a .223 Rem rifle from 26 all the way down to 16.5. I confirmed the range and dialed my correction according to my chart for the 505-yard steel. The same thing with the 556mm. The 6.5 CM is superior to the .308 Win in just about any practical sense of the matter with better range, less effect with wind, and less bullet drop. So, why isnt everyone jumping on board the Wylde train? I tried to pick out some popular ones on the market currently based on typical ranges most shooter's shoot out too. I still like my 300 Win. Another downside is that the 6mm Creedmoor does not buck the wind, It honestly feels like cheating when you are behind a quality 6.5 Creedmoor. Long range shooting is fun. It combines the highest ballistic coefficient with great accuracy, the highest velocity, and the least damage to the pelt. I sincerely am ready to listen to reason: Why is the .257 Weatherby ignored in these discussions? The basics: A .223 Remington can be fired in a 5.56x45mm marked barrel, but not the other way around. This is probably my inexperience talking but I have to ask why, when evaluating long range potential, the evaluations are always limited to flight path and ringing steel? The Fred Eichler Series Predator 2 from . The common effective range of a .223 for deer is 200-yards. Velocity for the loads ranged between 2720 feet per second and 2800 feet per second. Now for the real trial 1,000-yards. purchase helps support my work in bringing you more awesome gun and gear articles. Weve built dozens of ARs and well cover all the best AR-15 upgrades such as handguards, triggers, BCGs, gas blocks, and more. I use it long range and it does just fine. If I want to be a King of 2 Mile shooter .375 Cheytac hands down followed by a .50 BMG, if I want to overwatch an infantry squad either .338 Win Mag or .50 BMG, if cost isn't an issue Anzio Ironworks 20mm (yes 20mm), Barrett, AI, or a full up custom build. It's disconcerting to me that this cartridge always gets left out of the conversation. I use a 223 chamber in my Remington 700 Bolt gun. The slight difference in the point of measurement can account for a variance in pressure measurement of more than 20,000 psi. . Our sporting .223 Rem. Where less-than-perfect hits are concerned, more is better. View Latest Price . The .22 Nosler uses a 1:8 twist rate in its barrels, restricting bullet weight to 85 grains or less. Hand-Picked Daily GUN DEALS, and Exclusive Coupons Codes >>>, Hornady 68-grain Boat-Tail Hollow Point Match, Fully Multi-Coated, Full Wide Band, Waterproof Coated, Low Light Enhancement, Riton Bullet Drop Compensated (BDC) Reticle, Barrel: 16 chrome-moly, R4 profile, 1:9 twist. Our Fusion line is great example. That is just my opinion. It's basically 6.5cm on roides, yes. With the optic I had mounted it was apparent that I would run out of elevation adjustment well before the 1,000-yard targets. Zero-Stop means that once your zero is set and the turrets locked, your scope setting is at 0 for your sight in range. If I was going to combat today anywhere besides the flattest of deserts, a 16-inch barrel would be my choice. It is hard to believe that a .224-inch caliber bullet with a C.O.A.L. Of course, if you want to know a LOT more about the 6.5 Grendel you need to read the 6.5 Grendel Shootout! on the other hand, is loaded to a much-lower pressure, and has a much-shorter leade dimension. These short barrel lengths make the guns even handier inside structures, but also . He lives in Western Pennsylvania where he has enjoyed the outdoors, hunting, and shooting for the past 20 years. The trigger is very crisp. Not much else to say, sorry. The upper was placed on the Rock River lower to take advantage of the match trigger. So far, everyone who has an opinion on the .223 Wylde has intoned that it is a more accurate barrel chambering over the 5.56x45 or .223 Rem. Bottom line, I agree its in our best interest and the animals' best interest to get as close as we can. Get proficient on YOUR time. Start at min load and work your way up until you start seeing over pressure signs. So who is going to tell me how bad it is. I wanted to see if there was any appreciable difference in the PSA upper and the Rock River upper based on twist rate and the accuracy claim by Rock River. Copyright 2023 Pew Pew Media, Inc. All rights reserved. If youre lucky, shooting 5.56 ammo out of a rifle chambered in .223 will only increase fouling and speed up the wear and tear on your weapon. Thats a lot of freedom. You do not pay Technically speaking, a 223 Wylde rifle has identical chamber angling as a 5.5645 rifle but also brings a .2240 freebore diameter. Right here: ".300 Winchester Magnum is a favorite of hunters around the world for big game at long range. towards your level. I can only second what Rick says about the .257 Weatherby magnum. With a growing choice of ammo from 90-130 grain projectiles and the benefit of a great ballistic coefficient with the 6.5mm bullet, 500+ yard shooting can be almost boring. Prior this Ive been an old school kinda guy, shooting offhand and making sure I can hit what I aim at out to 300 yards. It weighs in at 55gr and offers the same quality as their higher-end products that you've come to expect. For a shooter wanting to use the .223 cartridge exclusively as their long-range plinker a 30mm tube scope with more vertical MOA adjustment is in order. Click below for a FREE LESSON! .223 Remington, being a civilian cartridge, is standardized by SAAMI (Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers Institute). The Zero-Reset allows the shooter to zero the scope, then with an Allen wrench remove the turret screws, return the turret setting back to zero and lock the turrets in place. Right now options are really slim and ammo prices are really high. Another 5.5 MOA and I was able to make 3 hits consecutively on this very small steel (about a 12x12 plate). At 300- and 428-yards I simply used the holdover dots on the reticle to make repeated hits. At the end of the day, your skill and time on a rifle is a much larger factor on how ethical a shot is. ammo in a 5.56 NATO chamber, but the reverse is not true. The 6mm Creedmoor has gained a lot of traction with competitive shooters over the last couple of years. The object of calling coyotes, is to call them close. It will be passed down to my son and so forth. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. After the first class was over I confirmed my zero at 100-yards and put five shots into about a one-inch group. While the odds of your rifle exploding are fairly slim, the chance is still there. It happened to shoot the, ammo, but Wolf offers extremely affordable plinking ammo with their, Once dialed in, I was able to put rounds on a steel silhouette, Ammunition choices have increased lately, and Hornady has ammunition with the, none of these choices are necessarily easy on the pocketbook, with most loads over $1/round. Cost, ease of part acquirement, availability, things you can run in an AR platform, or a perceived "coolness" factor? We haven't gotten any trigger time with it yet, but I'm hoping to do some testing soon. Unless the 300WM was down-loaded to unsafe levels, the 308 will never beat it. Depending on your ammo and rifle, that can vary between 150 and 400-yards. It has a Fred Eichler series muzzle break with a 1/2-28 thread. According to the ballistics charts on the boxes. This pressure difference makes it potentially dangerous to shoot the 5.56 NATO out of a .223 Remington chamber. Shot 80 grain .223 rounds at the 1,000 yard line during an InterService match in Quantico Virginia. (The only reasons I can think of to buy the 308 is if you are going compete in a competition that requires that caliber or you already have plenty of reloading gear for the 308 and you don't want to change that over also. An AR-15 chambered in .308 has an effective range to about 800 meters ; .338 Lapua's effective range is about 1500 meters; and .50 BMG has the range of . .223 Wylde Barrels 300 Blackout Barrels . The sky is the limit depending on your budget and what kind of rifle you want. you a link to reset your password. Able to fire both, but supposedly more accurate than a 5.56 chamber. Hopefully, as more shooters become aware of what .223 Wylde offers, well see the price drop and the availability rise. Ken Whitmore is a husband, father of two, and prior service United States Marine. Loc: southern Arizona. However, the main difference is in the leade. I, of course, did forget to keep track as I was shooting and turned back past my zero setting. When you dial new elevation and windage settings you must remember how many turns or clicks you used in order to reverse the turrets and return to your zero setting. Other manufacturers, such as Fulton Armory, offer modified "match chambers" with extended throats that allow safe use of 5.5645 ammo in .223 Remington rifles. The .223 Wylde produces optimal performance (even with less expensive ammo) and provides considerable versatility. With new( in the works)bullet designs the .308 surpasses the .300 win mag and is closing in on 6.5 ! .223 Wylde is Worth the Hype [See Why] 27580 view(s) 6.5 Creedmoor vs .308: The Numbers Don't Lie . Freebore is the space between a rifle's chamber and the rifling in the barrel. The .223 Wylde is a very popular cartridge for the AR-15, though it can be used in manual-action rifles and handguns in addition to the semi-automatic. The smaller gun powder capacity on the 223 bullet, however, means that the 223 have lower power as compared to the 5.56. It works with both 223 and 5.56. With the popularity of this cartridge due to Americas favorite rifle, the AR15, more and more people are stretching out its legs. I just think this article was not specifically a hunting article. After reaching out to 1,250 yards on a trip to the amazing High Bar Homestead in Gillette, WY, I am now a firm believer in the .224 Valkyrie. Don't need to be a super-awesome-Operator or competitive shooter to know this. While the Wylde muzzle velocities came in slightly faster, were talking about a one percent difference. Chief among them, the consistency of the ammunition is a variable outside of the limits of either rifle. With the .223 Remington round being the most popular for the AR-15 platform, this upper build kit will be an important part of creating your custom build using this caliber. You must log in or register to reply here. Has a capacity of 4 + 1 rounds. Factory loads are probably much less than 800yds. Everything on this list at the face value of the descriptor "long range" can be beaten out by better rounds, all of them. So I know there is a difference in dimensions between 223 Rem and 5.56, and that the Wylde is a compromise between the two. Ditto for the .300 PRC, which fixes every shortcoming of the .300 Win Mag and as the name implies (PRC - "Precision Rifle Cartridge") was made for accuracy at extreme long distance. more do I really need more ??? Basically, the .223 Wylde is like old-school Miley Cyrus. All the cases were then cleaned ultrasonically and tumbled in walnut media. Considering the TSX is pretty nicely barrier blind, it seems ideal or people who only ever intend to engage within the POA/POI range of 5.56 with a 50 yard zero (225/250 yards and in). Reserving range time is a Range USA Premium and Elite Member exclusive benefit. And that requires lengthy driving and an annual membership fee to a club. The .223 Wylde chamber (there are no .223 Wylde cartridges, so dont ask for them at your local gun shop) has the same leade angle and external dimensions of the 5.56 NATO. This is especially true if you put a bunch of lead downrange. His first 5 shots were all hits. I knew I needed bullets with a better BC to help them buck the wind a little better. For the TSX muzzle velocities, the 10.5", 14.5", 16", and . We could go into all sorts of great cartridges that frankly its hard to find anything that is a clear cut winner in the group. Ultimately, the choice between the two depends on your intended use, target, and desired shooting distance. However, the .300 Blackout has a noticeably shorter case length than the .223 Remington (1.368 vs 1.76). On up the hill to 718-yards. I wish we had as much long range shooting locations as they do out west. I wish there was more talk around 308 since you've established it as the baseline by which all long range cartridges are judged. I understand this is an old thread, but want to reply anyway, differences between .223 Rem. We decided on the RT-S MOD 3 GEN2 6-2450. Freebore is the space between a rifles chamber and the rifling in the barrel. Just dont expect the same level of accuracy you would get shooting .223 Remington cartridges out of a rifle with a .223 Remington chamber. The Wylde change in leade angle means the chamber . The password should contain at least 8 characters with at least one number or special character. But that can also vary from projectile to projectile. More than anything, we wanted to see if shooters could expect differences in velocity between the two. There's plenty of setups out there where 500 yd shots are simple things. It's primarily used in semi-automatic rifles, but there are some bolt action rifles that use it as well. Shouldn't penetration at the point of termination be a consideration? The brass was deprimed with a Lee Universal Decapping Die and the primer pockets swaged with a Dillon Super Swage. Made from high-quality materials. . SAAMI measures pressure from the middle of the case. Where the .308 Winchester comes up short, the 6.5 Creedmoor turns on the afterburners primarily because of the 6.5mm bullets excellent sectional density and ballistic coefficient. In a 5.5645 chambered rifle, the leade angle is .162 while the leade in a .223 Remington rifle is .085. Look at what the best are shooting in PRS, pretty much 6mm and variants. thanks and what of the 6.5cm PRC you have a picture of it but dont mention it. We discussed various options and the possibility of getting a scope in hand to test and use for this long range project. Subscribe to Pew Pew Tactical's sales and deals email. Just took me a 600+ pound cow elk 1 shot with my creedmore 200 yards away. Due to tighter . Maybe 250 if the stars align. . As a result of the pressure difference, 5.56 rounds also typically produce higher velocities. Once dialed in, I was able to put rounds on a steel silhouette with ease. If you have a laser range finder and know the exact distance, its not. That he us army has recorded kills with a 5.56 using black hills 77 grain ammo at 1800 yards? Pressures produced by a 5.56 cartridge are generally higher than those produced by a .223 round. towards your level. Need even more long range optics? Regarding the comment on the 6.5C, the laws of aerodynamics don't agree with you. It should be noted that I also shot these loads with a Palmetto State Armory Freedom upper with a 1:7 twist barrel. Availability is not the best either, so online buying or reloading may be the best option for this cartridge. A lack of energy is of particular concern in self-defense and hunting situations. I guess because it was my dad's and the first long distance rifle I was taught with. I could get close, but with the wind we experienced the short little 55-grain bullets were getting pushed all over the place. If you take a left turn, you can go through an endless list of wildcat cartridges as well. But what is 223 Wylde? Site Notices. not a fave I take it, Curious what your thoughts are about the Win 300 WSM. Ammo prices are a bit steeper than the previously mentioned cartridges, but the American Eagle 75-grain TMJs are relatively easy on the wallet. But the velocity with a lighter grain bullet and the case capacity makes for a tremendous long-range round. I competed in many 1000 yard and 1500 meter competitions. There are other options for barrels with fast twist rates and that are more affordable. Here I was shooting a rifle and cartridge combination that most people think is a much shorter range proposition. The rifle will be a dedicated predator rifle with a can hung off of the end. Ive not done the King of 2 mile thing but if I were younger it would have appealed to me. Rock River Arms guarantees the Ascendant ATH in .223 Wylde to shoot 3/4 MOA. The next target on the range is a 24 round plate at 813-yards. This rifle is built for precision with a 16" bead blasted cryogenically treated stainless steel fluted barrel with a 1:8 twist. That's a fine caliber, I said. By simply combining the dimensions of the 5.56 NATO and .223 Remington chambers to maximize the benefits of both, .223 Wylde offers a chamber that can feed and effectively stabilize a wider variety of ammunition, avoid any pressure-related issues, and maintain both the accuracy of the .223 cartridge and the muzzle velocity of the 5.56. Notify When In Stock . However, it also has the leade diameter of the .223 Remington. The rifle used for this little experiment is a stock Rock River Arms Entry Tactical model. However, it is pretty common knowledge that pressures in the 5.56 cartridge are higher than those in the .223. I don't hate the 308 at all, but it's been surpassed. If im trying to hunt, 300 Win Mag, 338 maybe a 7mm. All the other factors combined still dont add up to that one huge deterrent. On up the hill to 718-yards. Rifles chambered for .223 Wylde is 'multi-calber' and can fire 5.56x45mm cartridges alongside .223 Remington. So he took matters into his own hands and designed one. The password should contain at least 8 characters with at least one number or special character. Throughout the power range the target image stays clear and crisp even at 24 power. Also, the shorter barrel is easier to handle in tight areas than a 20 in (50.8 cm) or longer barrel. Sign up for a membership today and . District of . If you hunt prairie dogs or coyotes with lightweight .223 bullets, this twist rate will do fine for your needs. Long range shooting and competitions continue to grow and manufacturers continue to pour resources into new cartridges, better bullets, and more perfect rifles. I also encourage others to understand that their limits legitimately aren't limits for other people sometimes. It drops almost 400 inches at 1000 yards and drifts 100 inches at the same with a 10 MPH full value wind. Wind: Variable, 3-6 mph from every direction, The Range: Look closely and you can see steel at 300-, 428-, 505-, 637-, 718-, and 1,000-yards. .223 Remington/5.56 NATO - Old Faithful Assorted 5.56 Rounds (XM193, XM855, Gold Medal 69gr) While this may not be the first cartridge that comes to mind for long-range shooting, with an appropriate bullet, the compact .223 Remington or 5.56 NATO is more than capable of shooting over 500 yards with accuracy. .308 Winchester has been around for almost 70 years and has served militaries and police forces around the world as faithfully as it has served competition shooters. The barrel is chambered in .223 Wylde, which is a great choice for a rifle like this. It gives shooters the best of both worlds. With a .223 Wylde chamber, you can easily bounce back and forth between the two loads. I think it slightly beats the 224V), I'm from Italy. But where in the article does he even mention big game hunting. you a link to reset your password. It out performs the 6.5 Creedmore and the .308. passion is big-game hunting, mainly DIY backpack hunting deep in the wilderness. Summary of the .223 Wylde. Is it the 6.5 CM on steriodes but with out the kick of the 300 win mag? I don't expect to change your mind, but think respectful conversation is a good thing. Complete with ammo suggestions, capability, rifles, and more.